The result that's got me torn up, though, even though I should have expected it, is what's turning into the dominant narrative on how this happened. Dan Savage, as usual, is out in front with the knee-jerk no-analysis response, but he's not the only one to have said it. I've heard all over in personal conversations that Prop 8 passed because of black (or sometimes black and Latino) voters who came out to vote Obama and then deny gay people their rights.
I'm upset about this, not just because it's racist and not just because it lacks more than fifteen seconds of thought, but also because it's the same thing we hear every single time a gay initiative passes. People of color are so homophobic (this can also be replaced with 'Christians' or 'rednecks' if no people of color are available for scapegoating). And that's it. End of story. And then the next initiative comes around and they go and do the exact same thing and wonder why it fails again.
Before I even get into anything else, I want to point out that this 'POC vs. gay fight' frame completely makes invsible queer people of color, who, last I checked, actually exist, plus the hundreds of thousands of people of color, queer or straight, who voted against Prop 8. None of these groups are monolithic and trying to assign qualities to groups of millions of people is painting with a very broad brush.
So, first up. Black folks make up less than 7% of the population of California, as seen here. Even if they did go for prop 8, as the exit poll in question claims (and for the record, that is a breakout of 10% of a single exit poll of 2240 voters, which means that the sample was actually around 224 voters out of ten million, which makes the margin of error on that like 6 and half percent, so the poll can't say for certainty whether that 70% is actually 63.5% or 76.5%, plus of course the five-percent chance that the poll is an outlier in one direction or the other. They didn't even sample enough black men to be able to make an estimate), even if they did, they're still a small portion of the electorate. Further, as
But now, let's assume for a moment that the numbers are all great and representative and that voters of color did, in fact, provide a decisive swing to yes on Prop 8. Why would that be? The Nation has this. La Macha at VivirLatino has this. (There's a lot of great writing on this out there. I was following links for hours yesterday.) No on 8 specifically, and I do think this is common for LGBT initiatives, did little to no outreach to communities of color. They weren't printing up Spanish language signs. They weren't advertising in Asian-language newspapers. Yes on 8's television ads featured people of many races. No on 8's focused mostly on statements from white celebrities and elected officials. They ceded a huge swath of territory right from the start (and by that I don't just mean voters of color, but also folks who still think that being gay is a rich-people big-city thing). One of the big lessons of the Obama campaign is that there are persuadable voters everywhere. If gay legal campaigns just stay white liberals talking to white liberals, we're just going to be right back here again in a few years.
So what can be done? Practice those ally skills. Stand up against the racism out there, and not just when it's other white queers doing it. Petition large orgs to take positions on issues that matter, even if they don't see why they should. Policies that hurt people of color hurt queer people of color too. Learn to speak persuasively; disrespecting something that's important to someone is not likely to win you their support. And then maybe the next time something like this comes around, we'll be able and willing to talk to everyone.
November 7 2008, 16:29:41 UTC 3 years ago
mrdorbin for the win!
As a gay black male, all I have to say is mother fucking THIS!I touched on the matter myself yesterday in my blog for anyone who's interested in having a gander at it.
http://neo-prodigy.livejournal.com/5871
November 7 2008, 16:32:31 UTC 3 years ago
Here is another good post on this... hope the link works.
November 7 2008, 16:37:14 UTC 3 years ago
November 7 2008, 16:40:56 UTC 3 years ago
Psst ... the OP already linked that, in his article.
3 years ago
November 7 2008, 16:33:45 UTC 3 years ago
November 7 2008, 16:58:03 UTC 3 years ago
:: No on 8 specifically, and I do think this is common for LGBT initiatives, did little to no outreach to communities of color. They weren't printing up Spanish language signs. They weren't advertising in Asian-language newspapers. Yes on 8's television ads featured people of many races. No on 8's focused mostly on statements from white celebrities and elected officials. ::
Exactly the same thing happened here in Oregon, four years ago, with Measure 36. Fortunately, the org that spearheaded the No-on-36 campaign actually listened when queers-of-color orgs took them to task in the post-election debrief, and the mainstream org has since been trying to turn itself around.
Although one always wishes that they'd listened earlier. :-/
But given that history, I was watching Prop 8 ads in disbelief this election season, watching that same queers-are-white, POC-are-homophobic-straights lacunaes play themselves out all over again. SO MANY white people in the No-on-8 ads. ("Won't somebody think of the white queers??") And you know that there were scads of white people interpreting that absence as "communities of color are so homophobic that there's no point in the No campaign talking to them," and completely missing that "Won't somebody think of the rich, white queers??" is a frickin' asinine campaign message.
November 7 2008, 17:00:44 UTC 3 years ago
I haven't had to deal with this myself in person, but ugh the racism gay people can have is mind boggling.
November 7 2008, 19:22:23 UTC 3 years ago
November 8 2008, 12:44:21 UTC 3 years ago
3 years ago
3 years ago
3 years ago
3 years ago
3 years ago
3 years ago
3 years ago
3 years ago
3 years ago
November 7 2008, 17:03:27 UTC 3 years ago
That is so true. Thanks for pointing out my wrong thinking and making me learn something today. :^) This is precisely what I like about this comm.
November 7 2008, 17:06:02 UTC 3 years ago
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2008/1
November 7 2008, 17:44:33 UTC 3 years ago
November 7 2008, 17:50:40 UTC 3 years ago
November 7 2008, 18:03:48 UTC 3 years ago
The obvious lack of understanding the African American community (at large and the religious)and broad generalizations aren't surprising however.
I'm willing to bet none of the people screaming the hardest have even bothered to consider GLBT PoC.
Lots of fail to go around.
November 8 2008, 12:49:56 UTC 3 years ago
If everyone just "knew better" when they were oppressed in one area, we could just send all the straight white rich able-bodied men to Antarctica and reach utopia. ;) Seriously, I don't get the level of naiveté (ignorance is the better word) required to think the world works like that.
November 7 2008, 18:41:20 UTC 3 years ago
November 7 2008, 19:12:34 UTC 3 years ago
November 7 2008, 19:15:17 UTC 3 years ago
3 years ago
November 7 2008, 21:55:36 UTC 3 years ago
November 7 2008, 21:58:53 UTC 3 years ago
November 7 2008, 22:11:42 UTC 3 years ago
Nice job Savage, pick the smallest and least-likely-to-swing-the-vote minority and pick on them.
p.s. to the commenter above, 'Black America' didn't destroy your hopes in California; Conservative Predominantly White California did.
Also I am pretty sure that a lot more black Americans live in a lot more states than in California; am I as a white atheist pro-GLBTQ Washingtonian responsible for what my white Mormon anti-GLBTQ Utahn counterparts do with their ballots? Hell no.
Black America is not responsible for the shit-tastic No on 8 campaign; that responsibility lies squarely on Californian GLBTQ activists and their supporters.
November 8 2008, 01:02:46 UTC 3 years ago
November 8 2008, 05:30:41 UTC 3 years ago
November 8 2008, 12:40:32 UTC 3 years ago
People are really pissed off and they're knee-jerking, and, since the Magical Enlightenment Fairy doesn't fix the bigotry/privilege issues of everyone who happens to be in an oppressed group, a lot of them are knee-jerking in an asshatted, racist way. And that's very sad. (Dan Savage, you've besmirched my love for you. Again. He seems to say something very stupid every few months.)
On the other hand, now that I've seen a lot of backlash to the backlash, I am getting awfully pissed off at all the straight people pointing fingers at the racism of a monolithic queer community they don't even know, as if it were separable from or more shocking than racist heteros. No Magical Enlightenment Fairy here, any more than every PoC voter must "know better"; both are very naive and quite irritating ideas.
I'm seeing a lot of people saying, essentially, those racist queers of California got what they deserved because the No on 8 campaign was shitty, and that's infuriating. From where I am in Canada, it looks to me like a lot of people were complacent, directed their complacency in a racist way, and basically forgot how much heteros hate us. They should have acted far differently, but the message a lot of people seem to be getting is "you didn't work hard enough to earn your right, and you don't deserve it anyway because you're racist." You know, not every queer person in California, white or PoC, can devote their life to a political campaign. They all got screwed out of something rightfully theirs. And, in the end, that's not the fault of The Gay Community for not magically being ten times as enlightened as straight people; it's the fault of every homophobe, white or PoC, who was hateful or ignorant enough to mark "yes" on the ballot.
November 8 2008, 19:29:04 UTC 3 years ago
No group can expect people to vote on their behalf concerning an issue that MANY do not look at as a civil rights issue, but a MORAL CHOICE issue.
Before you EXPECT people to view it a certain way where there is already an ACKNOWLEDGED misconception - somebody has to lay the groundwork for making people comfortable with how you want(or need) them to vote.
To just say "Well they should know and be on our side" is just lazy and there was sloppy outreach to the African American community on this and that's NOBODY'S FAULT but the organizers opposing Prop 8.
3 years ago