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Thu, May. 15th, 2008, 09:47 pm
epilady: ARGH MOD NOTE ARGHHHHHHHHHH

OK look.

I'm reluctant to poke this eye-popping mess with a long, sharp stick, but many similar discussions have been coming up recently, and I need to reiterate:

debunkingwhite is dedicated to discussing WHITENESS, INSTITUTIONAL RACISM, and WHITE PRIVILEGE. That's it.

ANY OTHER DISCUSSIONS are definitely not appropriate for this community, and are likely to derail the conversations we are trying to have here. This community is specifically for white people to get the fuck over themselves and address their whiteness and white privilege.

When posting OR REPLYING TO ANY POST HERE, please consider the audience, the community's specific intent, and the fair to awesome potential for derailing the discussion.

General political debate, intra-POC conflicts, and other topics that do not encourage-slash-force the white members of this community to examine themselves, their whiteness, their racism, and their white privilege are not productive here, and belong somewhere else.

EVERY post should be examined and responded to with the goal of DEBUNKING WHITENESS foremost in mind. If your reply does not address this first and foremost? Please post it in another community. Or don't post it at all.

Please think carefully about engaging in a thread that may derail the conversation away from WHITENESS, INSTITUTIONAL RACISM, and WHITE PRIVILEGE. If your reply does not address these topics, there is probably a place for it, but that place is NOT Debunkingwhite.

It is all too easy for white people to wriggle out of, avoid, or imagine away their WHITENESS, INSTITUTIONAL RACISM, and WHITE PRIVILEGE. Man, white people love to have the heat on another burner so we can pat ourselves on the back and not think about our complicity in scenario XYZ. Please, do not make it any easier for the white people in this community by derailing the conversation.

Also, for the record? I don't personally believe it's in any way possible to separate institutional racism from immigration issues, particularly in a postcolonial world. Whether you agree with me or not, discussions about immigration issues in this community MUST remain focused on WHITENESS, INSTITUTIONAL RACISM, and WHITE PRIVILEGE. Please, keep other aspects in other communities so as not to derail the intentions of this community.

Thank you, and SORRY FOR ALL THE WACKY EMPHASIS CAPS OMG.
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Fri, May. 16th, 2008 11:40 pm (UTC)
tanya1976: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

The members of color can disagree with my argument. I welcome it. I don't expect all of us to think the same because of our complexions. A lot of what I feel/think may not be popular since it may force introspection (which a lot of my community can not seem to deal with).

Furthermore, yes, I'm looking at those who are going through the process of waiting to become a citizen. It's tough to see them. I have students waiting. It's a smack to their faces to see the ones who aren't being the most vocal.

I don't want to make this into an intra-POC thread, but, in all honesty, a lot of the disenfranchisements of poor people came from poor choices (a small percentage is from the actual laws on the books). There aren't any laws that say drop out of school, have more children than you can provide for, etc. I grew up in the inner-city. My family stressed education and goals. Without either one of these aspects, how the hell do you expect not to live in the projects?

Yes, poverty isn't a joke. But, when the law isn't the reason why you are initially in trouble, who's at fault? After a while, accountability has to be looked at.



Fri, May. 16th, 2008 11:43 pm (UTC)
likeawoman: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

I don't want to make this into an intra-POC thread, but, in all honesty, a lot of the disenfranchisements of poor people came from poor choices (a small percentage is from the actual laws on the books). There aren't any laws that say drop out of school, have more children than you can provide for, etc. I grew up in the inner-city. My family stressed education and goals. Without either one of these aspects, how the hell do you expect not to live in the projects?

Fri, May. 16th, 2008 11:54 pm (UTC)
tanya1976: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

So, what, are you denying what I'm saying? Or, are you shocked?

Fri, May. 16th, 2008 11:57 pm (UTC)
likeawoman: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

I'm always shocked when I see someone who, like myself, grew up poor and yet somehow manages to soak up such nasty, self-aggrandizing, classist, bootstrapping attitudes. all that education and not a single sociology class? that shit is sick.
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Sat, May. 17th, 2008 12:01 am (UTC)
likeawoman: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

they didn't teach me much book readin' in the trailer park and it's hard to concentrate with all the squalling brats and baying hounddogs and the mean case of bedbugs and all, but I think we agree :D

Sat, May. 17th, 2008 12:15 am (UTC)
lt_jim_dangle: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

haha, I wonder what those kids are looking at

Sat, May. 17th, 2008 12:16 am (UTC)
likeawoman: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

tanya1976's NC-17 Ayn Rand fanfic

Sat, May. 17th, 2008 02:45 pm (UTC)
delux_vivens: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

WIN!
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Sat, May. 17th, 2008 12:18 am (UTC)
tanya1976: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

So, you represent all? Is that it? My experience is different from yours. You don't know one thing about my experience; yet, you want to box me in because I'm disagreeing with some aspects. You have no idea of what I've seen. I currently work in an inner-city high school and I'm the only one desiring to stay so I can help my students. Yes, contrary to what you think. I give I damn. I made it out and I came back. Excuse me, if my standards do not include being an apologist for misguided behavior.

Yes, I have family that are dealing with intergenerational poverty. Why? They made bad choices, not because they couldn't get hired, despite working their asses off. That's terrible. Yes, I'm frustrated because of the inner-workings of some in my community. There isn't a reason for 73% of black children being born in single-parents, for example. What the hell? Is that the law's fault? Or, the climbing high-school dropout rate? Is that the law's fault as well? Should one receive a high school diploma without reading or writing English correctly? No, I agree with you on that issue. I teach my students (English) every day that when they leave school, the country isn't going to give a damn about you. Furthermore, I tell them not to give it ammunition not to.

So, go right ahead. If it makes you feel better to basically call me a sell-out and classist, then so be it. But, I'm in the thick of it every day. I could easily go somewhere ritzy and get paid, but I choose to stay because I honestly give a shit about my students. Yes, I set high standards because I know how the hell hard it is out there. I'm not going to let anyone on Internet tell me otherwise. You can settle for commonality or you can reach for something greater.
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Sat, May. 17th, 2008 12:04 am (UTC)
dottieneurotic: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

As someone who's made pretty much all of the right choices in her life (including getting a 40,000-dollar BA that I probably won't ever pay off) and is still living in the 'hood, struggling to make it out, I have to say that the assertion that I somehow haven't done what I'm supposed to is nothing short of ridiculous.

That is classism, plain and simple. You're not immune to it because you're black. Check it.

Sat, May. 17th, 2008 12:27 am (UTC)
tanya1976: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

In all honesty, no snarkiness intended. Why did I make it out and you didn't? What makes us so different?
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Sat, May. 17th, 2008 12:19 am (UTC)
lt_jim_dangle: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

A lot of what I feel/think may not be popular since it may force introspection (which a lot of my community can not seem to deal with).

Your views are obviously beyond my feeble and willfully uneducated negro mind. Usin' all dem big wordz.

Sat, May. 17th, 2008 12:26 am (UTC)
tanya1976: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

Don't go there with me, Jim. A lot of us don't. That's why Bill Cosby was attacked by those vocal community members. He aired "dirty laundry" that needed to be checked.
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Sat, May. 17th, 2008 02:53 pm (UTC)
delux_vivens: Re: What do you say about the members of color of

A lot of what I feel/think may not be popular since it may force introspection (which a lot of my community can not seem to deal with).

So that's it? An inability to cope with *introspection*?